Today’s CHASIcast marks the National Day of Remembrance and Action on Violence Against Women. On December 6th, 1989, 14 young women were murdered at Polytechnique Montréal by a gunman who targeted them specifically because of their gender. We take this day every year to remember them and to stand firmly and directly against misogyny and gender-based violence of all kinds.
This episode’s guest, Megan Capp is the Associate Director of Housing and Community Justice at Archway Community Services. She joins us to speak about her work focused on intimate partner violence and the advocacy and allyship that is most needed today.
After today’s interview, Dr. Sylvie Murray reads the names of the women who were murdered in 1989 while pursuing their studies in a male-dominated space.
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Transcript
CHASIcast voice-over 00:00
Coming up on the CHASIcast:
Megan Capp 00:06
I think we put a lot of fear on ourselves about this perception of being ready to step into spaces where we’re working on these very complex, very traumatic social issues…
CHASIcast voice-over 00:22
From UFV’s Community Health and Social Innovation Hub, this is the CHASIcast. A program dedicated to bringing experts and insights to the issues that shape our lives, because words have to matter.
December 6th is the National Day of Remembrance and Action on Violence Against Women. On December 6th, 1989, 14 women were murdered at Polytechnique Montreal by a gunman who targeted them specifically because of their gender. We take this day every year to remember them and to stand firmly and directly against misogyny and gender-based violence of all kinds.
Our guest, Megan Capp, will speak about her work focused on intimate partner violence and the advocacy and allyship that is most needed today.
After today’s interview, Dr. Sylvie Murray will read the names of the women killed in 1989 while pursuing their studies in a male-dominated space.
Now, here’s your host, CHASI director, Dr. Martha Dow.
CHASIcast voice-over 01:25
Now, here’s your host, CHASI director, Dr. Martha Dow.
Martha Dow 1:30
Hi. I’m really fortunate to have Megan Capp today as our guest on the CHASIcast. And I think Megan, you wear so many hats in our community and do so much good work. Wonder if you might introduce yourself given the topic that we’re exploring today.
Megan Capp 1:43
Sure. Thank you so much for having me. So my primary role in community is as the Associate Director of Housing and Community Justice for Archway Community Services. So in that role, I oversee a variety of programs primarily focused on housing and homelessness. I oversee supportive housing and shelters, so working with clients and client groups that have a lot of really complex needs. I also oversee our family and poverty legal advocacy services, which are kind of grassroots legal empowerment initiatives, and the specialized Victim Assistance Program, which is a direct hit with intimate partner violence (IVP). It’s a partnership project, working in collaboration with the Abbotsford police department to support victims of IPV.
Martha Dow 2:27
As we approach December 6th, you know, it’s hard not to think and reflect on where we are in 2025 with respect to violence against women, given your experience, and I also know you do a great deal of research and academic work in these areas, can we start by just saying, you know, what are your perceptions?
Megan Capp 2:43
I find that I need to focus on the bright spots, because if I don’t, the work can feel too heavy. So thinking about the bright spots, I do feel it’s essential to recognize that some progress has been made. For example, reporting is up, even though we still know that this is a very, very under reported crime, we’re seeing reporting rates going up. We’re seeing additional awareness, especially in our community.
Megan Capp 3:09
We have a fantastic initiative called the Purple Lights Nights program, which is every October, and it’s a fantastic event in Jubilee Park that brings together everyone, just anyone in community is welcome. There are survivors who speak, some of our community partners speak, and it’s just a really holistic gathering that takes a stand against this in our community and provides some camaraderie for victims and survivors who are experiencing this.
Megan Capp 3:36
When I think about the not so bright spots, there are also many of those. I think the criminal justice system, while there have been efforts made to make the process more victim and survivor friend—friendly doesn’t sound like the right word—but more supportive to victims and survivors. I think some progress has been made, especially if you look at the partnership happening here in our own community.
Megan Capp 4:02
I do think there still are significant avenues for reform. Dr. Kim Stanton just released a fantastic report making some key system recommendations as to how that system can reform itself to be more supportive.
Martha Dow 4:18
Can you talk a bit about that? What kinds of areas that she focused on.
Megan Capp 4:22
So Dr. Kim Stanton made a variety of recommendations in her report. Recommendation one is actually that the BC government declare that gender based violence is a provincial epidemic. I think that’s a really interesting one, because when I look at other forms of crime or other public safety issues, we see a lot more outrage than we see with this issue. Some of her other recommendations focus more on training different people who might come into contact with victims and survivors, strengthening the system wide framework for education, also building more partnerships within community based organizations, because I think there is so much power in those spaces to be able to respond in a way which mitigates some of the harm that can happen moving through a traditional criminal justice process.
Martha Dow 5:11
You mentioned outrage. I think that’s a really interesting one. Can you talk a little bit about why you think that’s so that we don’t see that? I mean, you mentioned about reporting being up and so we talk a lot about the hidden figure of crime with respect to this. Can you talk a little bit about that outrage and the lower levels than maybe we’d like to see?
Megan Capp 5:31
I think there’s no easy answer for that, and when I’m reflecting on it from my own experience and in the spaces that I’ve been in recently focused on this issue, it’s hard to ignore the fact that it is so gendered. So we know that most victims and survivors are female. When you look at the people who are doing the advocating and are engaged in that outrage, it is also predominantly female. I was recently in Victoria for a conference, and it was hard not to notice the absence of men in the room here in our community, we do have some fantastic men. We have amazing police leadership who are very committed to this issue. But I think that needs to broaden, and I think more men need to be drawn into this issue, recognizing that they are predominantly the perpetrators.
Martha Dow 6:18
When that comes up, often we hear people, you know, “we don’t want to blame all men”, and, of course, we’re not doing that. What do you think is needed to sort of, you know, light that fire in a community, not just with individuals, but broader.
Megan Capp 6:31
I think one of the things I’ve learned in my work, and this is something that’s evolved over time. I’ve been working in the social serving sector for over 15 years now. I think it is really hard to get people to buy into your cause if it is full of outrage, I think we have to have healthier channels to draw people in, and especially when I’m thinking about men, recognizing the social serving organizations are predominantly female, if I think about different pathways to drawing them in. I think we really need to celebrate the things that we want to see. So we want to celebrate healthy masculinity. We want to celebrate healthy relationships, instead of just bashing down everything that we know perpetuates the issue but also prevents us from creating some really good community solutions.
Martha Dow 7:21
You mentioned a few of those just a few minutes before. I wonder, what are the characteristics do you think of a community that really starts to have positive change around this issue, as you’ve described in Abbotsford, in your experience?
Megan Capp 7:34
Yeah. So when I say I oversee the specialized Victim Assistance Program at Archway, that is a bit of a tricky one for me, because the team that I oversee is really embedded in this. There’s so much passion, there’s so much commitment day to day, to working to solve this issue. I’m kind of on the periphery, offering support where I can, and making linkages between different programs, because we do know this is an intersectional issue. When I observe them, and it’s been an absolute privilege to observe them, the key piece is collaboration.
Megan Capp 8:10
So when I compare what’s happening in this space with what’s happening in my work pertaining to homelessness, within homelessness, there’s a lot of great collaboration happening, but it’s still emerging, like we’re still establishing that community norm where this is how we do things, this is how we support people. I think when you look at the work happening in community on intimate partner violence, there is so much passion and collaboration that really translates into positive outcomes. And if you look at the partners that are coming together for this specialized Victim Assistance Program. It’s the Abbotsford Police Department, there’s social workers and victim service workers who are actually embedded in the police department. I know how challenging it is to work across sectors, and trying to build the bridge between a social service organization and the police department is very challenging because you have very different types of people working within those spaces.
Megan Capp 9:02
So the fact that in our local community, we have people on both sides who are willing to step out of the confines of their organization and create innovation, I think, has led to really, really inspiring outcomes, and I’m inspired by it when I look at the level of collaboration happening, how we’re able to really wrap around people and walk with them through their journey of healing, whatever that might look like from these types of crimes, I think there’s a lot of lessons we can learn from the work that’s happening here in Abbotsford.
Martha Dow 9:30
Some of the issues that have been brought up around this have to do with the impact of Covid, the impact of lack of affordability in terms of housing options, and how that impacts women who are trying to leave violent situations. Can you talk a little bit about that experience?
Megan Capp 9:47
Yeah, we know the transition houses here in town are always full, and I think that’s quite a common narrative across the province and across the nation. I oversee shelters, and I can tell you that we have people who do not fit the traditional shelter guest model, who are staying in shelters, who have not been homeless at all in their lives, just because they weren’t able to gain a spot in a transition house. So that is challenging for me, because the gap is so huge. The gap with housing and opportunities for people who want to leave is so huge that even though I focus on the bright spots and try to think of all the positive work that’s happened, that’s something that really hits close to home.
Martha Dow 10:31
You talked about the role of men in this. One of the things I think a lot about is how we raise our boys, and that makes me think about a lot of the work you do is about collaboration. So school systems, community programming, you know, I could think about sports teams, you know, all of that. Could you talk a bit more about that aspect?
Megan Capp 10:50
Yeah, I agree with you that the way we raise our boys and our sons matter, and what we expose them to, and the relationships that we have during that pivotal time in their development are also crucial and essential. I think one of the things I noticed that I would love to see reformed, especially at the community based level, is integrating these conversations in different spaces. So right now, like I’ve talked about, we have this fantastic collaboration with the police and MCFD and Crown and all these fantastic people working together once a crime is reported and once it gets into the system, because this is a crime that is so under reported, we know that the prevalence of people, and primarily women, that are experiencing this is exponential. It’s huge. So we know, if we’re thinking about the school system, we know that there are children who are being exposed to this in their homes that have not come to the attention of either the criminal justice system or social supports. So I think embedding this across different areas would help us really challenge and address the scourge that is happening.
Megan Capp 11:59
I think if I look at my experiences just stepping into this, I’ve only been overseeing this area for about the past year, but even in that year, I noticed that the 14 years before that, that I’ve been working in the social serving sector, there hasn’t been much conversation about intimate partner violence like it is very focused, and perhaps it has to be when there is, like a charge and a criminal justice response, and that is a technical process. But when I’m thinking about advocacy and awareness, I do think we have to be integrating conversations about intimate partner violence and gender based violence across any social issue that we’re talking about.
Megan Capp 12:40
And I think we also have to challenge our own biases. Stepping into this a year ago, I realized I had so many biases around this topic, not bias in a negative way, but just misinformation based on what I’m hearing in media and other sources, where it took me a bit of time to retrain my mind and listen to my team and hear the actual stats, and see who is actually coming through our doors, to recognize that this is an issue that really impacts everyone. It’s not isolated to one specific cultural group, one specific population group. It impacts everyone at every level of society. So I think integrating conversations at all of those various levels is essential.
Martha Dow 13:23
I agree with you, and I think and then holding both that at the same time as there are specialized populations that are at greater risk, and you, of course, know that, and Indigenous women, members of the queer community. Have you in terms of community response, have you seen particular programs or approaches, or what’s been your experience with respect to these populations that are at a higher risk?
Megan Capp 13:46
It’s interesting, because the populations that are at higher risk are also the ones who have the most mistrust of the criminal justice system. So those are the ones who aren’t yet reporting. They’re not yet ready to pursue a charging process. So when I think about what can be done at the community levels, I think there needs to be dedicated attention given towards drawing those different population groups into supports. And I think we have some fantastic initiatives like the inclusivity of Purple Light Nights, that event, it really is, everyone is welcome, and I think creating more of those spaces where all of these different types of community members can show up, feel safe, feel supported, and have a real conversation about some of the issues that might be impacting them. I think there’s a lot of potential in that approach.
Martha Dow 14:36
I’m interested in talking to you about the work that victims do. It’s something we’ve chatted about before, and I know it cuts across various topics, but you know, that’s fatigue factor and the telling of the story, and I think we’re seeing more of that on different social issues. Can you talk a little bit about that labor, if you will?
Megan Capp 14:56
I’m a firm believer that responses to social issues need to be driven by people who are directly impacted by them, but in reality, in practice, that is difficult to achieve in a way which honors their experiences without also dipping into spaces of exploitation. When I look at what’s been done in homelessness, I think we’ve been on a learning curve, trying to find different ways and trying different things—some work, some don’t work—of drawing people with lived experiences in to respond to the solutions, but there has to be some type of structural support for the people, because it is emotional labor. They’ve just gone through this traumatic experience and being put in a position where they’re required to speak about that, especially to people who don’t always agree with them or might be quite volatile in hearing their story. I think the emotional toll of that is not always adequately recognized, and there need to be better mechanisms for support of anyone telling their traumatic story.
Megan Capp 16:03
There are some fantastic people who are leading this work. I’m a big fan of Marlee Liss. She is a woman who fought to have her sexual assault case heard through a restorative justice process rather than a criminal justice process. She’s a fantastic advocate for including survivor voices in responses to sexual violence. So I look at her as a model of how this can be done well, while also recognizing there is a lot of nuance to making that happen in an ethical, sustainable way.
Martha Dow 16:34
I’d love for you to talk a bit more about that. I know I’ve been in a number of conversations where that idea of restorative justice, where there’s violent crimes and what works better for which kinds of crimes? Can you talk a bit more about that?
Megan Capp 16:46
Yeah, for sure, this is actually an area that I do some research on, and my approach to restorative justice, it is a bit controversial, and when I present at conferences, I do face some backlash from the community serving organizations that I speak to. But my approach to restorative justice is there has to be some component that focuses on the public safety considerations and the potential of recidivism for the person going through the process. So traditionally, restorative justice has been seen as something that is victim centered, which is fantastic. That is a healthy and necessary response to some of the harms that we see perpetuated by someone moving through a criminal justice process with less focus given to the person who has actually committed the crime.
Megan Capp 17:35
I think the reason restorative justice hasn’t yet fully been integrated and accepted as [an] adequate response to crime, as a parallel with the criminal justice system, is because we haven’t had that focus on the person who’s doing the harm, and primarily how it’s used across Canada and even globally, is for low level crimes, especially for young people. So a young person might shoplift and be referred to restorative justice. The argument that I make in my research is that that process, so it’s usually like a mediation or healing type situation where the young person offers an apology or some type of reparation. What I argue is there’s not enough consideration given to the social, environmental, familiar factors that impact that person’s engagement with criminal behaviour in the first place.
Martha Dow 18:57
So I think it’s really interesting your conversation around restorative justice, what would that look like in terms of the kind of intimate partner violence we’re talking about today?
Megan Capp 19:09
I think there’s tremendous potential for restorative justice to be a healthy response to intimate partner violence and sexual violence. If you look at the response of the traditional criminal justice system, there’s not much happening in terms of rehabilitation for people who have committed these types of crimes, often moving through that criminal justice process creates additional barriers for them and complicates the relationships that they have. So I think taking a more holistic approach that really looks at the background factors and the social factors that led that person to commit these types of crimes would be essential.
Megan Capp 19:46
Of course, that’s easy for me to say on a podcast. Implementing that in practice is much more difficult, but like I mentioned with Marlee, it has been done. It has been done successfully in cases of sexual violence. I think Ontario is really leading the way with that. In BC we are a little bit behind, but I would like to closely monitor that and have that evaluated, and also not lose the victim focus. So even though there has to be some focus on the person who has committed the crime, we can’t lose the victim focus. It still has to be a victim centered process. So having opportunity to navigate those nuances, have those projects evaluated, especially through a victim centered lens, I think, would be essential. And then have information sharing about this across Canada, across provinces across Canada.
Martha Dow 20:34
I wanted to ask you, you’ve talked about, we’ve talked about the labor in terms of victims and how they are part of advocating for change and system change, et cetera. Wonder if you could talk about staff and the work that they do, and the impact of that work and the trauma related to that work.
Megan Capp 20:51
This is something that I’m really passionate about. I really care deeply about giving not only my teams but anyone working in the social serving sector, the tools and support they need to do these jobs. Well, I think in this sector, it’s a really interesting dynamic, because you have people who come with so much passion and so much desire to change systems and support people, and then when they’re working in these environments where they’re exposed to continuous trauma, when I’m looking at my housing and shelter work, I mean, it’s constant death overdoses, situations of violence. There’s a lot of negativity that is just part of the work, and we’re happy to do it, but we don’t talk enough about the mental toll that that takes on someone, especially if they’re doing this work for a sustained amount of time.
Megan Capp 21:39
So I’ve been trying to mobilize my teams and community to create more of a of a support system. It’s still in the early stages. We’re definitely not there yet. But considering these issues have been going on for decades, and we’ve been responding for decades, it’s quite frustrating that we don’t have better support mechanisms in place to support the staff who are doing this very difficult work. When I look at my team that’s supporting intimate partner violence victims, they do a fantastic job of supporting each other, and that’s a consistent theme that I see, including in my work with homelessness, the team culture is everything. You need to be able to go to work, show up, know that the person that you’re working alongside will have total trust in you. You have total trust in them, and you are getting through this together.
Megan Capp 22:31
I sometimes think that there needs to be another level of tha. We often have access to an employee assistance program, which is a counselling type service that the institution offers, which is fantastic for some people, but it’s not a great fit for everyone. So again, my hope is with conversations about the realities that frontline staff doing this work are facing, we can develop some really effective solutions. But again, that’s an area where there’s a lot of work to do.
Martha Dow 23:01
Really appreciate your focus on finding space for that. One of the things I hear a lot in different kinds of projects that we’re doing is that the people doing the work feel almost badly about talking about what their own needs are because of the issues that they’re, you know, helping to support others on. And I think that makes it really challenging.
Megan Capp 23:21
Yeah, absolutely. This is a field where people show up with a lot of selflessness, there is a lot of compassion, a lot of really strong commitment to the issues that they’re working to solve. I’m really honoured to work alongside fantastic teams across all of the areas that I oversee and within the community as well.
Martha Dow 23:41
So, Megan, you’ve talked lots about sort of system change. You’ve talked about collaboration. I think associated with that is, you know, the idea of allyship. I wonder if you could talk a bit about what that looks like. You’ve also mentioned the important role of men to play in this. What are your thoughts on that?
Megan Capp 23:57
Yeah, I think just recognizing that this is such an interdisciplinary topic, and we really need a interdisciplinary response where everyone is coming to the table to take on their key little piece of this, whatever it might be, people have different levels of tolerance for different types of things. I think there needs to be a lot more working together across institutions. And again, we have fantastic pockets of that. CHASI is a fantastic ally and supporter of the work being done at the community based levels. We also have a fantastic researcher in the criminology department of UFV, Dr. Amanda McCormick, who is actually embedded in this day to day work alongside the nonprofit partners, and then produces research that meets the needs of the nonprofit partners and the people experiencing these issues, which is just absolutely fantastic. It’s such a gift to have academic knowledge that’s actually targeting the local level and can inform the decisions that we make.
Megan Capp 24:55
When it comes to men, I think we just need more men to be involved. And I think we can and do, do a good job of creating that environment where they feel safe to step into, but I think there needs to be a lot more work in them mobilizing themselves.
Martha Dow 25:13
So when you talk about men coming together, it’s an interesting one, right? Because in many ways, we want to have this, just as you’ve talked about this, more complex conversation across genders. And yet, I think it’s interesting you feel like there’s that need, obviously, to mobilize for men as well. And yet, I got to say, I don’t feel as optimistic in these times as we see increasing polarization around so many issues. What would that look like? What would it have to take to have that? And again, there are obviously men that are committed to these conversations, these conversations are happening. But I think what we’re saying is there needs to be more.
Megan Capp 25:53
There needs to be more. I think it would take boldness and bravery and having men step into this space and make public statements that this is not okay, and we’re going to mobilize our communities around this and be there for each other and model vulnerability. That if you’re either a victim or a perpetrator of these types of crimes, it’s okay to talk about it. I do think that the polarization of our communities and… it’s so prevalent and it impacts our ability to get things done. I think a lot of people would maybe be curious about stepping into the space, or eager to help, but there is something holding them back. I think we put a lot of fear on ourselves about this perception of being ready to step into spaces where we’re working on these very complex, very traumatic social issues. And I would just really encourage people to get involved. Reach out to Archway, we’ll find opportunities for you to be involved and to learn more.
Martha Dow 26:55
When you think about an ally, because I think that’s been a very interesting conversation in different circles. When you think about an ally, what do you think about? What are those characteristics that make a good ally?
Megan Capp 27:08
I think empathy, and when I say empathy, I mean the ability to hold space for a perspective that’s different than yours, and a lived experience that’s different than yours, but to be able to hold that space in a way where you do really honor their lived experience, I think also this, this dynamic of coming alongside. We get quite set in our ways, especially when it comes to polarizing, highly traumatic social issues. We all have different perceptions of it. We all have different ways of processing that vicarious trauma that’s just inherent to doing this work. And I think being able to have enough self reflection where you can suspend that judgment like I disclosed I had so many biases about this topic before I stepped into supporting my teams doing this work. I think having that self awareness and self reflection to be able to recognize, “okay, I actually, I’m not an expert in this. I have something to offer, but I really do need to be guided by the voices of the people who are either experiencing this directly or who are working with those people who have experienced this directly.”
Martha Dow 28:21
You mentioned earlier that the reporting is going up. And so as you’re as you’re describing, you know, the need to have more conversation, et cetera, and you’re describing that reporting is going up, makes me think about the public private divide, this idea that this is a very private issue. Historically, we’ve certainly seen that. But I don’t think that’s too long ago that we still see, you know, what happens in the home, kind of thing. And then you add into that affordability issues. You add into it children, and you know, often, more generally, women trying to make the best decisions they possibly can in those situations. Can you talk a little bit about where you think we are in terms of this being a private issue, and how that contributes to silence or perpetuating the silence, and maybe even the difficulties in men getting involved in these issues to a greater extent.
Megan Capp 29:07
Yeah, I definitely see, even though there’s been fantastic advocacy urging society as a whole to take on and tackle this problem, I do still see that public private divide where it is something that’s generally confined to homes, and I think not enough care and awareness has been given to considering the periphery impacts, especially on children who witness these types of crimes and who are not given the support that they’re needed, because no one has ever come forward to talk about what’s happening.
Martha Dow 29:37
So when you think about the public private divide, is that a gendered impact as well? Do you see that impacting men and women differently in terms of the telling of the story, the shame, the stigma, those kinds of things?
Megan Capp 29:49
I think so. I don’t have the best assessment of that, because I don’t work directly with victims and survivors. I oversee the work and support again, at like kind of that periphery level. I do, when I reflect on some experiences that I’ve had, I do think there remains more shame with men coming forward when they have been victimized. So I think because this has been such a gendered issue for so long, there is much more attention faced, much more attention placed on drawing women’s voices forward. I think there needs to be more intentionality about drawing forward the voices of men who have been victimized, and the creation of spaces where men who have committed these types of offenses are given the opportunity to talk through it, share, access counseling like really dig down deep into the root causes of what made them commit this behavior, so that there can be that transformation.
Martha Dow 30:48
You sort of started about talking about we don’t talk about it enough, and yet, some of the solutions to this, obviously, are that we need to talk more about it. I wondered, we’ve talked about intimate partner violence. We’re talking about this subject because December 6th is coming up, which is a very different kind of violence against women.
Martha Dow 31:06
As we approach December 6th, what does that day mean to you? What do you tend to reflect on, where there’s possibly, I appreciate that you brought up, you know, bright lights and important spots where we’re seeing some positive movement. What does it mean to you? And what do you think about on that day?
Megan Capp 31:22
I think it’s a day of reflection. I think it’s a day where I take inventory of the work that’s been done, both locally, provincially and across Canada on this topic. When I reflect on that in previous years, I do continue to be encouraged by the progress, but it’s hard not to also recognize the huge gaps and the immense amount of work that needs to be done to really shift our culture, the way that we talk about these issues, where we talk about these issues and with whom, in order to make a real difference. So it’s a day of complicated emotions, because there’s celebration for the progress that’s been made, which I mean, if you reflect back 50 years, 100 years, we are going in the right direction. But also it’s difficult not to get overwhelmed by the mountain of work ahead.
Martha Dow 32:18
Thank you so much for the work you do in our community, and thank you for taking time out of what I know is a very busy schedule to have this conversation.
Megan Capp 32:26
Thank you for having me.
Martha Dow 32:27
Our pleasure.
CHASIcast voice-over 32:35
CHASI remembers the 14 young women whose lives tragically ended on December 6th, 1989.
Geneviève Bergeron, 21 years old. Engineering student.
Hélène Colgan, 23 years old. Engineering student.
Nathalie Croteau, 23 years old. Engineering student.
Barbara Daigneault, 22 years old. Engineering student.
Anne-Marie Edward, 21 years old. Engineering student.
Maud Haviernick. 29 years old. Engineering student.
Barbara Klucznik-Widajewicz, 31 years old. Nursing student.
Maryse Laganière, 25 years old, employee in the finance department.
Maryse Leclair, 23 years old, engineering student.
Anne-Marie Lemay, 22 years old. Engineering student.
Sonia Pelletier, 28 years old. Engineering student.
Michèle Richard, 21 years old. Engineering student.
Annie St-Arneault, 23 years old. Engineering student.
Annie Turcotte, 21 years old. Engineering student.